How to obtain a polynomial with these conditions?Finding $p'(0)$ for the polynomial of least degree which has...

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How to obtain a polynomial with these conditions?


Finding $p'(0)$ for the polynomial of least degree which has a local maximum at $x=1$ and a local minimum at $x=3$What is the minimum degree of a polynomial for it to satisfy the following conditions?Let $P$ be a 4-th degree real polynomial with 5 conditions given. How to compute $P(4)$?Solving polynomial problems with matrices and vectorsForce some polynomial to have certain roots.Find minimal polynomial over $mathbb{Q}[x]$.Find the constant term of polynomialDetermine polynomial function of degree 4.






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}







3












$begingroup$


I want to construct a polynomial of degree at least 4 with local maximums at $(-2,1)$ and $(3,4)$ and local minimum at $(1,-2)$. It's easy to draw to have some idea of how $f$ is.



I've tried to solve a linear system with $f(x)=ax^4+bx^3+cx^2+dx+e$



$f(3)=4, f(1)=-2, f(-2)=1$



But I don't know what to do with $f'(x)$ because there are two variables left to solve the system but three local extremes' conditions to fix: $f'(-2)=0, f'(1)=0, f'(3)=0$.










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$














  • $begingroup$
    I mean the point (x,y)=(1,-2) is a local minumum.
    $endgroup$
    – Aarón David Arroyo Torres
    13 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    What happens when you write out the linear equations defined by the derivative conditions?
    $endgroup$
    – Travis
    13 hours ago






  • 5




    $begingroup$
    You want 6 conditions for a 4th order polynomial. I think you have to set 5 and hope you get lucky.
    $endgroup$
    – Matthew Daly
    13 hours ago


















3












$begingroup$


I want to construct a polynomial of degree at least 4 with local maximums at $(-2,1)$ and $(3,4)$ and local minimum at $(1,-2)$. It's easy to draw to have some idea of how $f$ is.



I've tried to solve a linear system with $f(x)=ax^4+bx^3+cx^2+dx+e$



$f(3)=4, f(1)=-2, f(-2)=1$



But I don't know what to do with $f'(x)$ because there are two variables left to solve the system but three local extremes' conditions to fix: $f'(-2)=0, f'(1)=0, f'(3)=0$.










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$














  • $begingroup$
    I mean the point (x,y)=(1,-2) is a local minumum.
    $endgroup$
    – Aarón David Arroyo Torres
    13 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    What happens when you write out the linear equations defined by the derivative conditions?
    $endgroup$
    – Travis
    13 hours ago






  • 5




    $begingroup$
    You want 6 conditions for a 4th order polynomial. I think you have to set 5 and hope you get lucky.
    $endgroup$
    – Matthew Daly
    13 hours ago














3












3








3


3



$begingroup$


I want to construct a polynomial of degree at least 4 with local maximums at $(-2,1)$ and $(3,4)$ and local minimum at $(1,-2)$. It's easy to draw to have some idea of how $f$ is.



I've tried to solve a linear system with $f(x)=ax^4+bx^3+cx^2+dx+e$



$f(3)=4, f(1)=-2, f(-2)=1$



But I don't know what to do with $f'(x)$ because there are two variables left to solve the system but three local extremes' conditions to fix: $f'(-2)=0, f'(1)=0, f'(3)=0$.










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$




I want to construct a polynomial of degree at least 4 with local maximums at $(-2,1)$ and $(3,4)$ and local minimum at $(1,-2)$. It's easy to draw to have some idea of how $f$ is.



I've tried to solve a linear system with $f(x)=ax^4+bx^3+cx^2+dx+e$



$f(3)=4, f(1)=-2, f(-2)=1$



But I don't know what to do with $f'(x)$ because there are two variables left to solve the system but three local extremes' conditions to fix: $f'(-2)=0, f'(1)=0, f'(3)=0$.







polynomials






share|cite|improve this question















share|cite|improve this question













share|cite|improve this question




share|cite|improve this question








edited 13 hours ago









J. W. Tanner

14.4k1 gold badge10 silver badges31 bronze badges




14.4k1 gold badge10 silver badges31 bronze badges










asked 13 hours ago









Aarón David Arroyo TorresAarón David Arroyo Torres

2331 silver badge10 bronze badges




2331 silver badge10 bronze badges















  • $begingroup$
    I mean the point (x,y)=(1,-2) is a local minumum.
    $endgroup$
    – Aarón David Arroyo Torres
    13 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    What happens when you write out the linear equations defined by the derivative conditions?
    $endgroup$
    – Travis
    13 hours ago






  • 5




    $begingroup$
    You want 6 conditions for a 4th order polynomial. I think you have to set 5 and hope you get lucky.
    $endgroup$
    – Matthew Daly
    13 hours ago


















  • $begingroup$
    I mean the point (x,y)=(1,-2) is a local minumum.
    $endgroup$
    – Aarón David Arroyo Torres
    13 hours ago










  • $begingroup$
    What happens when you write out the linear equations defined by the derivative conditions?
    $endgroup$
    – Travis
    13 hours ago






  • 5




    $begingroup$
    You want 6 conditions for a 4th order polynomial. I think you have to set 5 and hope you get lucky.
    $endgroup$
    – Matthew Daly
    13 hours ago
















$begingroup$
I mean the point (x,y)=(1,-2) is a local minumum.
$endgroup$
– Aarón David Arroyo Torres
13 hours ago




$begingroup$
I mean the point (x,y)=(1,-2) is a local minumum.
$endgroup$
– Aarón David Arroyo Torres
13 hours ago












$begingroup$
What happens when you write out the linear equations defined by the derivative conditions?
$endgroup$
– Travis
13 hours ago




$begingroup$
What happens when you write out the linear equations defined by the derivative conditions?
$endgroup$
– Travis
13 hours ago




5




5




$begingroup$
You want 6 conditions for a 4th order polynomial. I think you have to set 5 and hope you get lucky.
$endgroup$
– Matthew Daly
13 hours ago




$begingroup$
You want 6 conditions for a 4th order polynomial. I think you have to set 5 and hope you get lucky.
$endgroup$
– Matthew Daly
13 hours ago










5 Answers
5






active

oldest

votes


















4













$begingroup$

You're right to be concerned. If you have six conditions and five unknowns, you would have to relax one condition and pray that the missing condition is met "accidentally".



One way around it is that your polynomial has to be at least degree four, so there's nothing stopping you from finding a fifth degree polynomial that meets all of those conditions. You have to be sure to double-check your solution to make sure that the turning points are all maxima or minima as you had hoped, though, because sometimes the gods of polynomial interpolation can be fickle.






share|cite|improve this answer









$endgroup$























    2













    $begingroup$

    Let $$ f'(x)=(ax+b)(x+2)(x-3)(x-1)$$



    Upon integration you find a polynomial for $f(x)$ with parameters $a,b,c$ which could be found by the given information about $f(x)$ such as $f(-2)=1$ and so forth.






    share|cite|improve this answer









    $endgroup$























      1













      $begingroup$

      Let $f(x):=ax^4+bx^3+cx^2+dx+e$, so $f'(x)=4ax^3+3bx^2+2cx+d$ and $f''(x)=12ax^2+6bx+2c$



      First off, the derivative of $f$ should vanish for $xin{-2,1,3}$, so:
      $$begin{cases}-32 a + 12 b - 4 c + d=0\ 4 a + 3 b + 2 c + d=0\ 108 a + 27 b + 6 c + d=0end{cases}$$
      The second derivatives should be negative for local maxima and positive for local minima:
      $$begin{cases}24 a - 6 b + c<0\ 54 a + 9 b + c<0\6 a + 3 b + c>0end{cases}$$
      Now, the additional conditions give:
      $$begin{cases}81 a + 27 b + 9 c + 3 d + e = 4\a + b + c + d + e + 2 = 0\16 a - 8 b + 4 c - 2 d + e =1 end{cases}$$



      Wolfram Alpha says that no solutions exist. I checked by hand, imposing only 5 out of 6 conditions each time, and if my calculations didn't go extremely wrong, there should indeed be no such polynomials.






      share|cite|improve this answer









      $endgroup$























        0













        $begingroup$

        Hint



        This makes it way so harder. As the extrema happen at ${-2,1,3}$, then these must stand as the roots of the 1st order differentiation i.e.$$f'(x)=a(x+2)(x-1)(x-3)g(x)$$ where $g(x)$ is another polynomial that can be taken equal to $1$ in its simplest case. For deciding whether the extrema are minimum or maximum, you can use the 2nd order differentiation test and to obtain $f(x)$ integrate $f'(x)$.



        P.S.



        If the problem had no solution with $g(x)=1$, try a more general form of $g(x)$.






        share|cite|improve this answer









        $endgroup$























          0













          $begingroup$

          You are looking for



          $$f(x)=sum_{i=0}^na_ix^i$$



          subject to constraints



          $$begin{cases}
          f(-2)=1\
          f'(-2)=0\
          f''(2)le0\
          f(3)=4\
          f'(3)=0\
          f''(3)le0\
          f(1)=-2\
          f'(1)=0\
          f''(1)ge0\
          nge 4
          end{cases}$$



          Given there is no upper limit on the degree of the polynomial, there are an infinite number of solutions. There may not be one for $n=4$.






          share|cite|improve this answer











          $endgroup$


















            Your Answer








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            5 Answers
            5






            active

            oldest

            votes








            5 Answers
            5






            active

            oldest

            votes









            active

            oldest

            votes






            active

            oldest

            votes









            4













            $begingroup$

            You're right to be concerned. If you have six conditions and five unknowns, you would have to relax one condition and pray that the missing condition is met "accidentally".



            One way around it is that your polynomial has to be at least degree four, so there's nothing stopping you from finding a fifth degree polynomial that meets all of those conditions. You have to be sure to double-check your solution to make sure that the turning points are all maxima or minima as you had hoped, though, because sometimes the gods of polynomial interpolation can be fickle.






            share|cite|improve this answer









            $endgroup$




















              4













              $begingroup$

              You're right to be concerned. If you have six conditions and five unknowns, you would have to relax one condition and pray that the missing condition is met "accidentally".



              One way around it is that your polynomial has to be at least degree four, so there's nothing stopping you from finding a fifth degree polynomial that meets all of those conditions. You have to be sure to double-check your solution to make sure that the turning points are all maxima or minima as you had hoped, though, because sometimes the gods of polynomial interpolation can be fickle.






              share|cite|improve this answer









              $endgroup$


















                4














                4










                4







                $begingroup$

                You're right to be concerned. If you have six conditions and five unknowns, you would have to relax one condition and pray that the missing condition is met "accidentally".



                One way around it is that your polynomial has to be at least degree four, so there's nothing stopping you from finding a fifth degree polynomial that meets all of those conditions. You have to be sure to double-check your solution to make sure that the turning points are all maxima or minima as you had hoped, though, because sometimes the gods of polynomial interpolation can be fickle.






                share|cite|improve this answer









                $endgroup$



                You're right to be concerned. If you have six conditions and five unknowns, you would have to relax one condition and pray that the missing condition is met "accidentally".



                One way around it is that your polynomial has to be at least degree four, so there's nothing stopping you from finding a fifth degree polynomial that meets all of those conditions. You have to be sure to double-check your solution to make sure that the turning points are all maxima or minima as you had hoped, though, because sometimes the gods of polynomial interpolation can be fickle.







                share|cite|improve this answer












                share|cite|improve this answer



                share|cite|improve this answer










                answered 13 hours ago









                Matthew DalyMatthew Daly

                2,9381 silver badge21 bronze badges




                2,9381 silver badge21 bronze badges




























                    2













                    $begingroup$

                    Let $$ f'(x)=(ax+b)(x+2)(x-3)(x-1)$$



                    Upon integration you find a polynomial for $f(x)$ with parameters $a,b,c$ which could be found by the given information about $f(x)$ such as $f(-2)=1$ and so forth.






                    share|cite|improve this answer









                    $endgroup$




















                      2













                      $begingroup$

                      Let $$ f'(x)=(ax+b)(x+2)(x-3)(x-1)$$



                      Upon integration you find a polynomial for $f(x)$ with parameters $a,b,c$ which could be found by the given information about $f(x)$ such as $f(-2)=1$ and so forth.






                      share|cite|improve this answer









                      $endgroup$


















                        2














                        2










                        2







                        $begingroup$

                        Let $$ f'(x)=(ax+b)(x+2)(x-3)(x-1)$$



                        Upon integration you find a polynomial for $f(x)$ with parameters $a,b,c$ which could be found by the given information about $f(x)$ such as $f(-2)=1$ and so forth.






                        share|cite|improve this answer









                        $endgroup$



                        Let $$ f'(x)=(ax+b)(x+2)(x-3)(x-1)$$



                        Upon integration you find a polynomial for $f(x)$ with parameters $a,b,c$ which could be found by the given information about $f(x)$ such as $f(-2)=1$ and so forth.







                        share|cite|improve this answer












                        share|cite|improve this answer



                        share|cite|improve this answer










                        answered 12 hours ago









                        Mohammad Riazi-KermaniMohammad Riazi-Kermani

                        52.4k4 gold badges27 silver badges73 bronze badges




                        52.4k4 gold badges27 silver badges73 bronze badges


























                            1













                            $begingroup$

                            Let $f(x):=ax^4+bx^3+cx^2+dx+e$, so $f'(x)=4ax^3+3bx^2+2cx+d$ and $f''(x)=12ax^2+6bx+2c$



                            First off, the derivative of $f$ should vanish for $xin{-2,1,3}$, so:
                            $$begin{cases}-32 a + 12 b - 4 c + d=0\ 4 a + 3 b + 2 c + d=0\ 108 a + 27 b + 6 c + d=0end{cases}$$
                            The second derivatives should be negative for local maxima and positive for local minima:
                            $$begin{cases}24 a - 6 b + c<0\ 54 a + 9 b + c<0\6 a + 3 b + c>0end{cases}$$
                            Now, the additional conditions give:
                            $$begin{cases}81 a + 27 b + 9 c + 3 d + e = 4\a + b + c + d + e + 2 = 0\16 a - 8 b + 4 c - 2 d + e =1 end{cases}$$



                            Wolfram Alpha says that no solutions exist. I checked by hand, imposing only 5 out of 6 conditions each time, and if my calculations didn't go extremely wrong, there should indeed be no such polynomials.






                            share|cite|improve this answer









                            $endgroup$




















                              1













                              $begingroup$

                              Let $f(x):=ax^4+bx^3+cx^2+dx+e$, so $f'(x)=4ax^3+3bx^2+2cx+d$ and $f''(x)=12ax^2+6bx+2c$



                              First off, the derivative of $f$ should vanish for $xin{-2,1,3}$, so:
                              $$begin{cases}-32 a + 12 b - 4 c + d=0\ 4 a + 3 b + 2 c + d=0\ 108 a + 27 b + 6 c + d=0end{cases}$$
                              The second derivatives should be negative for local maxima and positive for local minima:
                              $$begin{cases}24 a - 6 b + c<0\ 54 a + 9 b + c<0\6 a + 3 b + c>0end{cases}$$
                              Now, the additional conditions give:
                              $$begin{cases}81 a + 27 b + 9 c + 3 d + e = 4\a + b + c + d + e + 2 = 0\16 a - 8 b + 4 c - 2 d + e =1 end{cases}$$



                              Wolfram Alpha says that no solutions exist. I checked by hand, imposing only 5 out of 6 conditions each time, and if my calculations didn't go extremely wrong, there should indeed be no such polynomials.






                              share|cite|improve this answer









                              $endgroup$


















                                1














                                1










                                1







                                $begingroup$

                                Let $f(x):=ax^4+bx^3+cx^2+dx+e$, so $f'(x)=4ax^3+3bx^2+2cx+d$ and $f''(x)=12ax^2+6bx+2c$



                                First off, the derivative of $f$ should vanish for $xin{-2,1,3}$, so:
                                $$begin{cases}-32 a + 12 b - 4 c + d=0\ 4 a + 3 b + 2 c + d=0\ 108 a + 27 b + 6 c + d=0end{cases}$$
                                The second derivatives should be negative for local maxima and positive for local minima:
                                $$begin{cases}24 a - 6 b + c<0\ 54 a + 9 b + c<0\6 a + 3 b + c>0end{cases}$$
                                Now, the additional conditions give:
                                $$begin{cases}81 a + 27 b + 9 c + 3 d + e = 4\a + b + c + d + e + 2 = 0\16 a - 8 b + 4 c - 2 d + e =1 end{cases}$$



                                Wolfram Alpha says that no solutions exist. I checked by hand, imposing only 5 out of 6 conditions each time, and if my calculations didn't go extremely wrong, there should indeed be no such polynomials.






                                share|cite|improve this answer









                                $endgroup$



                                Let $f(x):=ax^4+bx^3+cx^2+dx+e$, so $f'(x)=4ax^3+3bx^2+2cx+d$ and $f''(x)=12ax^2+6bx+2c$



                                First off, the derivative of $f$ should vanish for $xin{-2,1,3}$, so:
                                $$begin{cases}-32 a + 12 b - 4 c + d=0\ 4 a + 3 b + 2 c + d=0\ 108 a + 27 b + 6 c + d=0end{cases}$$
                                The second derivatives should be negative for local maxima and positive for local minima:
                                $$begin{cases}24 a - 6 b + c<0\ 54 a + 9 b + c<0\6 a + 3 b + c>0end{cases}$$
                                Now, the additional conditions give:
                                $$begin{cases}81 a + 27 b + 9 c + 3 d + e = 4\a + b + c + d + e + 2 = 0\16 a - 8 b + 4 c - 2 d + e =1 end{cases}$$



                                Wolfram Alpha says that no solutions exist. I checked by hand, imposing only 5 out of 6 conditions each time, and if my calculations didn't go extremely wrong, there should indeed be no such polynomials.







                                share|cite|improve this answer












                                share|cite|improve this answer



                                share|cite|improve this answer










                                answered 13 hours ago









                                Mr. XcoderMr. Xcoder

                                8794 silver badges21 bronze badges




                                8794 silver badges21 bronze badges


























                                    0













                                    $begingroup$

                                    Hint



                                    This makes it way so harder. As the extrema happen at ${-2,1,3}$, then these must stand as the roots of the 1st order differentiation i.e.$$f'(x)=a(x+2)(x-1)(x-3)g(x)$$ where $g(x)$ is another polynomial that can be taken equal to $1$ in its simplest case. For deciding whether the extrema are minimum or maximum, you can use the 2nd order differentiation test and to obtain $f(x)$ integrate $f'(x)$.



                                    P.S.



                                    If the problem had no solution with $g(x)=1$, try a more general form of $g(x)$.






                                    share|cite|improve this answer









                                    $endgroup$




















                                      0













                                      $begingroup$

                                      Hint



                                      This makes it way so harder. As the extrema happen at ${-2,1,3}$, then these must stand as the roots of the 1st order differentiation i.e.$$f'(x)=a(x+2)(x-1)(x-3)g(x)$$ where $g(x)$ is another polynomial that can be taken equal to $1$ in its simplest case. For deciding whether the extrema are minimum or maximum, you can use the 2nd order differentiation test and to obtain $f(x)$ integrate $f'(x)$.



                                      P.S.



                                      If the problem had no solution with $g(x)=1$, try a more general form of $g(x)$.






                                      share|cite|improve this answer









                                      $endgroup$


















                                        0














                                        0










                                        0







                                        $begingroup$

                                        Hint



                                        This makes it way so harder. As the extrema happen at ${-2,1,3}$, then these must stand as the roots of the 1st order differentiation i.e.$$f'(x)=a(x+2)(x-1)(x-3)g(x)$$ where $g(x)$ is another polynomial that can be taken equal to $1$ in its simplest case. For deciding whether the extrema are minimum or maximum, you can use the 2nd order differentiation test and to obtain $f(x)$ integrate $f'(x)$.



                                        P.S.



                                        If the problem had no solution with $g(x)=1$, try a more general form of $g(x)$.






                                        share|cite|improve this answer









                                        $endgroup$



                                        Hint



                                        This makes it way so harder. As the extrema happen at ${-2,1,3}$, then these must stand as the roots of the 1st order differentiation i.e.$$f'(x)=a(x+2)(x-1)(x-3)g(x)$$ where $g(x)$ is another polynomial that can be taken equal to $1$ in its simplest case. For deciding whether the extrema are minimum or maximum, you can use the 2nd order differentiation test and to obtain $f(x)$ integrate $f'(x)$.



                                        P.S.



                                        If the problem had no solution with $g(x)=1$, try a more general form of $g(x)$.







                                        share|cite|improve this answer












                                        share|cite|improve this answer



                                        share|cite|improve this answer










                                        answered 13 hours ago









                                        Mostafa AyazMostafa Ayaz

                                        19.6k3 gold badges10 silver badges42 bronze badges




                                        19.6k3 gold badges10 silver badges42 bronze badges


























                                            0













                                            $begingroup$

                                            You are looking for



                                            $$f(x)=sum_{i=0}^na_ix^i$$



                                            subject to constraints



                                            $$begin{cases}
                                            f(-2)=1\
                                            f'(-2)=0\
                                            f''(2)le0\
                                            f(3)=4\
                                            f'(3)=0\
                                            f''(3)le0\
                                            f(1)=-2\
                                            f'(1)=0\
                                            f''(1)ge0\
                                            nge 4
                                            end{cases}$$



                                            Given there is no upper limit on the degree of the polynomial, there are an infinite number of solutions. There may not be one for $n=4$.






                                            share|cite|improve this answer











                                            $endgroup$




















                                              0













                                              $begingroup$

                                              You are looking for



                                              $$f(x)=sum_{i=0}^na_ix^i$$



                                              subject to constraints



                                              $$begin{cases}
                                              f(-2)=1\
                                              f'(-2)=0\
                                              f''(2)le0\
                                              f(3)=4\
                                              f'(3)=0\
                                              f''(3)le0\
                                              f(1)=-2\
                                              f'(1)=0\
                                              f''(1)ge0\
                                              nge 4
                                              end{cases}$$



                                              Given there is no upper limit on the degree of the polynomial, there are an infinite number of solutions. There may not be one for $n=4$.






                                              share|cite|improve this answer











                                              $endgroup$


















                                                0














                                                0










                                                0







                                                $begingroup$

                                                You are looking for



                                                $$f(x)=sum_{i=0}^na_ix^i$$



                                                subject to constraints



                                                $$begin{cases}
                                                f(-2)=1\
                                                f'(-2)=0\
                                                f''(2)le0\
                                                f(3)=4\
                                                f'(3)=0\
                                                f''(3)le0\
                                                f(1)=-2\
                                                f'(1)=0\
                                                f''(1)ge0\
                                                nge 4
                                                end{cases}$$



                                                Given there is no upper limit on the degree of the polynomial, there are an infinite number of solutions. There may not be one for $n=4$.






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                                                $endgroup$



                                                You are looking for



                                                $$f(x)=sum_{i=0}^na_ix^i$$



                                                subject to constraints



                                                $$begin{cases}
                                                f(-2)=1\
                                                f'(-2)=0\
                                                f''(2)le0\
                                                f(3)=4\
                                                f'(3)=0\
                                                f''(3)le0\
                                                f(1)=-2\
                                                f'(1)=0\
                                                f''(1)ge0\
                                                nge 4
                                                end{cases}$$



                                                Given there is no upper limit on the degree of the polynomial, there are an infinite number of solutions. There may not be one for $n=4$.







                                                share|cite|improve this answer














                                                share|cite|improve this answer



                                                share|cite|improve this answer








                                                edited 1 hour ago

























                                                answered 2 hours ago









                                                Dale MDale M

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