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Is this statement about a motion being simple harmonic in nature strong?


Pendulum's motion is simple harmonic motionSimple harmonic motion versus oscillationsPhase angle in simple harmonic motionSimple harmonic motion about an unstable equilibrium position?Energy in simple harmonic motion ─ where is the kinetic energy stored, and where is the potential energy?Why can all solutions to the simple harmonic motion equation be written in terms of sines and cosines?Basics of simple harmonic motion






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}







4












$begingroup$


Is the statement




"If the potential energy of a particle under oscillatory motion is directly
proportional to the second power of displacement from the mean
position, the particle performs a simple harmonic motion."




as strong as saying it in a more famous form of




"If the force due to oscillation on a particle under oscillatory motion is
directly proportional to the displacement from the mean position and
directed towards the mean position, the particle performs a simple
harmonic motion."




I think it cannot be regarded as equally strong, since if we derive the expression for potential energy for any oscillatory motion, using taylor expansion, we get

only for small oscillations that $$U(x) = frac{1}{2} U''(x_0) x^2$$ (where $U(x_0)$ is the potential energy at mean position) and we only get this result after certain approximations. Can someone please confirm this? Isn't the second statement stronger and more general? What I mean is, is the first statement always true?










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$














  • $begingroup$
    Please tell us the sources of the quotes.
    $endgroup$
    – Ben Crowell
    44 mins ago


















4












$begingroup$


Is the statement




"If the potential energy of a particle under oscillatory motion is directly
proportional to the second power of displacement from the mean
position, the particle performs a simple harmonic motion."




as strong as saying it in a more famous form of




"If the force due to oscillation on a particle under oscillatory motion is
directly proportional to the displacement from the mean position and
directed towards the mean position, the particle performs a simple
harmonic motion."




I think it cannot be regarded as equally strong, since if we derive the expression for potential energy for any oscillatory motion, using taylor expansion, we get

only for small oscillations that $$U(x) = frac{1}{2} U''(x_0) x^2$$ (where $U(x_0)$ is the potential energy at mean position) and we only get this result after certain approximations. Can someone please confirm this? Isn't the second statement stronger and more general? What I mean is, is the first statement always true?










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$














  • $begingroup$
    Please tell us the sources of the quotes.
    $endgroup$
    – Ben Crowell
    44 mins ago














4












4








4





$begingroup$


Is the statement




"If the potential energy of a particle under oscillatory motion is directly
proportional to the second power of displacement from the mean
position, the particle performs a simple harmonic motion."




as strong as saying it in a more famous form of




"If the force due to oscillation on a particle under oscillatory motion is
directly proportional to the displacement from the mean position and
directed towards the mean position, the particle performs a simple
harmonic motion."




I think it cannot be regarded as equally strong, since if we derive the expression for potential energy for any oscillatory motion, using taylor expansion, we get

only for small oscillations that $$U(x) = frac{1}{2} U''(x_0) x^2$$ (where $U(x_0)$ is the potential energy at mean position) and we only get this result after certain approximations. Can someone please confirm this? Isn't the second statement stronger and more general? What I mean is, is the first statement always true?










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$




Is the statement




"If the potential energy of a particle under oscillatory motion is directly
proportional to the second power of displacement from the mean
position, the particle performs a simple harmonic motion."




as strong as saying it in a more famous form of




"If the force due to oscillation on a particle under oscillatory motion is
directly proportional to the displacement from the mean position and
directed towards the mean position, the particle performs a simple
harmonic motion."




I think it cannot be regarded as equally strong, since if we derive the expression for potential energy for any oscillatory motion, using taylor expansion, we get

only for small oscillations that $$U(x) = frac{1}{2} U''(x_0) x^2$$ (where $U(x_0)$ is the potential energy at mean position) and we only get this result after certain approximations. Can someone please confirm this? Isn't the second statement stronger and more general? What I mean is, is the first statement always true?







forces classical-mechanics potential-energy harmonic-oscillator approximations






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edited 10 hours ago









Aaron Stevens

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asked 10 hours ago









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  • $begingroup$
    Please tell us the sources of the quotes.
    $endgroup$
    – Ben Crowell
    44 mins ago


















  • $begingroup$
    Please tell us the sources of the quotes.
    $endgroup$
    – Ben Crowell
    44 mins ago
















$begingroup$
Please tell us the sources of the quotes.
$endgroup$
– Ben Crowell
44 mins ago




$begingroup$
Please tell us the sources of the quotes.
$endgroup$
– Ben Crowell
44 mins ago










3 Answers
3






active

oldest

votes


















3













$begingroup$

Let's consider your first statement. If the potential energy of a particle under oscillatory motion is directly proportional to the second power of displacement from the mean position, then we can write the expression for potential at any position $x$ as $$U(x-x_0)=A(x-x_0)^2$$ where $A$ is our proportionality constant and $x_0$ is the mean position, which makes $x-x_0$ the displacement from the mean position. After expanding $$U(x-x_0)=Ax_0^2-2Ax_0x+Ax^2.$$ Now we know that $F=-{dU(x-x_0) over dx}$. So, for our potential energy, it becomes- $$F=-(-2Ax_0+2Ax)=2Ax_0-2Ax=-2A(x-x_0)$$ which mirrors your second statement. So they're equivalent for a single dimension. And we get those two statement equally strong in Euclidean space of arbitrary dimension. Verify it. But let's not stop here.
Consider your first statement in a non-Euclidean space. In this case, the expression for our potential is $U=A ({sqrt {g_{mu nu}dx^mu dx^nu}})^2=Ag_{mu nu}dx^mu dx^nu$. According to your second statement, we expect $F^mu=-Bdx^mu$.

According to the definition of force, $$F^mu=-g^{mu nu}nabla_nu U=-g^{mu nu}partial_nu(Ag_{sigma rho}dx^sigma dx^rho)=-2Adx^mu-Ag^{mu nu}g_{sigma rho, nu}dx^rho dx^sigma.$$So, if we want this last expression to meet our expectation, we must impose one condition, that is the value of $g_{sigma rho,nu}$ must be zero.



So, it seems that for the later case your second statement impose more restriction than your first one. So your first statement is more general, but the second one is stronger.

Plea: Can someone please verify my claims and calculation for the non-Euclidean part?






share|cite|improve this answer










New contributor



Minotaur is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.





$endgroup$











  • 2




    $begingroup$
    The force you calculated is proportional to the negative displacement. The first statement is not weaker, at least not because of your reasoning.
    $endgroup$
    – Puk
    10 hours ago








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Wait, why isn't $nabla_nu U=partial_nu U$ given that $U$ is a scalar and that the covariant derivative is the same as a partial derivative for a scalar?
    $endgroup$
    – Dvij Mankad
    7 hours ago








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    The issue with your calculation raised in my previous comment might be related to this but, anyway, your indices in the second term of your final expression are messed up. You have two $alpha$s upstairs and two $rho$s downstairs. Might be an independent mistake--I haven't explicitly gone through your calculation.
    $endgroup$
    – Dvij Mankad
    7 hours ago








  • 1




    $begingroup$
    @DvijMankad , I've followed your lead, recalculated and edited it. This time it needs less restriction.
    $endgroup$
    – Minotaur
    7 hours ago






  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Finally, since $dx^rho_{,nu}=delta^rho_nu$, your first term collapses to $-2Adx^mu$. And, your second term is a second-order infinitesimal while the first is a first-order one. So, you have to drop the second term leading to no difference between the non-Euclidean case and the Euclidean case. xD
    $endgroup$
    – Dvij Mankad
    6 hours ago



















3













$begingroup$

Both of your statements are true for SHM and can be seen as true for approximations as well. Each statement is essentially saying the same thing, because $F=-text dU/text dx$, and we can choose $U(0)=0$. Whether or not you use approximations to make these statements applicable to your system doesn't change that.



In other words, if you have approximated $Upropto x^2$, then you are also approximating $Fpropto -x$. Both of your statements say the same thing. Therefore, they are equally "strong".






share|cite|improve this answer









$endgroup$























    1













    $begingroup$

    If the potential energy is quadratic in the displacement only for small oscillations, then the restoring force is proportional to the (negative) displacement only for small oscillations. So I would not say the second statement is more general. The one statement is exactly true, so is the other. If one is only approximately true, so is the other.



    Here I'm ignoring the fact that the potential energy is unique up to an arbitrary additive constant, and because of a non-zero constant it may not be proportional the the square of the displacement as in your first statement.






    share|cite|improve this answer









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      3 Answers
      3






      active

      oldest

      votes








      3 Answers
      3






      active

      oldest

      votes









      active

      oldest

      votes






      active

      oldest

      votes









      3













      $begingroup$

      Let's consider your first statement. If the potential energy of a particle under oscillatory motion is directly proportional to the second power of displacement from the mean position, then we can write the expression for potential at any position $x$ as $$U(x-x_0)=A(x-x_0)^2$$ where $A$ is our proportionality constant and $x_0$ is the mean position, which makes $x-x_0$ the displacement from the mean position. After expanding $$U(x-x_0)=Ax_0^2-2Ax_0x+Ax^2.$$ Now we know that $F=-{dU(x-x_0) over dx}$. So, for our potential energy, it becomes- $$F=-(-2Ax_0+2Ax)=2Ax_0-2Ax=-2A(x-x_0)$$ which mirrors your second statement. So they're equivalent for a single dimension. And we get those two statement equally strong in Euclidean space of arbitrary dimension. Verify it. But let's not stop here.
      Consider your first statement in a non-Euclidean space. In this case, the expression for our potential is $U=A ({sqrt {g_{mu nu}dx^mu dx^nu}})^2=Ag_{mu nu}dx^mu dx^nu$. According to your second statement, we expect $F^mu=-Bdx^mu$.

      According to the definition of force, $$F^mu=-g^{mu nu}nabla_nu U=-g^{mu nu}partial_nu(Ag_{sigma rho}dx^sigma dx^rho)=-2Adx^mu-Ag^{mu nu}g_{sigma rho, nu}dx^rho dx^sigma.$$So, if we want this last expression to meet our expectation, we must impose one condition, that is the value of $g_{sigma rho,nu}$ must be zero.



      So, it seems that for the later case your second statement impose more restriction than your first one. So your first statement is more general, but the second one is stronger.

      Plea: Can someone please verify my claims and calculation for the non-Euclidean part?






      share|cite|improve this answer










      New contributor



      Minotaur is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.





      $endgroup$











      • 2




        $begingroup$
        The force you calculated is proportional to the negative displacement. The first statement is not weaker, at least not because of your reasoning.
        $endgroup$
        – Puk
        10 hours ago








      • 1




        $begingroup$
        Wait, why isn't $nabla_nu U=partial_nu U$ given that $U$ is a scalar and that the covariant derivative is the same as a partial derivative for a scalar?
        $endgroup$
        – Dvij Mankad
        7 hours ago








      • 1




        $begingroup$
        The issue with your calculation raised in my previous comment might be related to this but, anyway, your indices in the second term of your final expression are messed up. You have two $alpha$s upstairs and two $rho$s downstairs. Might be an independent mistake--I haven't explicitly gone through your calculation.
        $endgroup$
        – Dvij Mankad
        7 hours ago








      • 1




        $begingroup$
        @DvijMankad , I've followed your lead, recalculated and edited it. This time it needs less restriction.
        $endgroup$
        – Minotaur
        7 hours ago






      • 1




        $begingroup$
        Finally, since $dx^rho_{,nu}=delta^rho_nu$, your first term collapses to $-2Adx^mu$. And, your second term is a second-order infinitesimal while the first is a first-order one. So, you have to drop the second term leading to no difference between the non-Euclidean case and the Euclidean case. xD
        $endgroup$
        – Dvij Mankad
        6 hours ago
















      3













      $begingroup$

      Let's consider your first statement. If the potential energy of a particle under oscillatory motion is directly proportional to the second power of displacement from the mean position, then we can write the expression for potential at any position $x$ as $$U(x-x_0)=A(x-x_0)^2$$ where $A$ is our proportionality constant and $x_0$ is the mean position, which makes $x-x_0$ the displacement from the mean position. After expanding $$U(x-x_0)=Ax_0^2-2Ax_0x+Ax^2.$$ Now we know that $F=-{dU(x-x_0) over dx}$. So, for our potential energy, it becomes- $$F=-(-2Ax_0+2Ax)=2Ax_0-2Ax=-2A(x-x_0)$$ which mirrors your second statement. So they're equivalent for a single dimension. And we get those two statement equally strong in Euclidean space of arbitrary dimension. Verify it. But let's not stop here.
      Consider your first statement in a non-Euclidean space. In this case, the expression for our potential is $U=A ({sqrt {g_{mu nu}dx^mu dx^nu}})^2=Ag_{mu nu}dx^mu dx^nu$. According to your second statement, we expect $F^mu=-Bdx^mu$.

      According to the definition of force, $$F^mu=-g^{mu nu}nabla_nu U=-g^{mu nu}partial_nu(Ag_{sigma rho}dx^sigma dx^rho)=-2Adx^mu-Ag^{mu nu}g_{sigma rho, nu}dx^rho dx^sigma.$$So, if we want this last expression to meet our expectation, we must impose one condition, that is the value of $g_{sigma rho,nu}$ must be zero.



      So, it seems that for the later case your second statement impose more restriction than your first one. So your first statement is more general, but the second one is stronger.

      Plea: Can someone please verify my claims and calculation for the non-Euclidean part?






      share|cite|improve this answer










      New contributor



      Minotaur is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.





      $endgroup$











      • 2




        $begingroup$
        The force you calculated is proportional to the negative displacement. The first statement is not weaker, at least not because of your reasoning.
        $endgroup$
        – Puk
        10 hours ago








      • 1




        $begingroup$
        Wait, why isn't $nabla_nu U=partial_nu U$ given that $U$ is a scalar and that the covariant derivative is the same as a partial derivative for a scalar?
        $endgroup$
        – Dvij Mankad
        7 hours ago








      • 1




        $begingroup$
        The issue with your calculation raised in my previous comment might be related to this but, anyway, your indices in the second term of your final expression are messed up. You have two $alpha$s upstairs and two $rho$s downstairs. Might be an independent mistake--I haven't explicitly gone through your calculation.
        $endgroup$
        – Dvij Mankad
        7 hours ago








      • 1




        $begingroup$
        @DvijMankad , I've followed your lead, recalculated and edited it. This time it needs less restriction.
        $endgroup$
        – Minotaur
        7 hours ago






      • 1




        $begingroup$
        Finally, since $dx^rho_{,nu}=delta^rho_nu$, your first term collapses to $-2Adx^mu$. And, your second term is a second-order infinitesimal while the first is a first-order one. So, you have to drop the second term leading to no difference between the non-Euclidean case and the Euclidean case. xD
        $endgroup$
        – Dvij Mankad
        6 hours ago














      3














      3










      3







      $begingroup$

      Let's consider your first statement. If the potential energy of a particle under oscillatory motion is directly proportional to the second power of displacement from the mean position, then we can write the expression for potential at any position $x$ as $$U(x-x_0)=A(x-x_0)^2$$ where $A$ is our proportionality constant and $x_0$ is the mean position, which makes $x-x_0$ the displacement from the mean position. After expanding $$U(x-x_0)=Ax_0^2-2Ax_0x+Ax^2.$$ Now we know that $F=-{dU(x-x_0) over dx}$. So, for our potential energy, it becomes- $$F=-(-2Ax_0+2Ax)=2Ax_0-2Ax=-2A(x-x_0)$$ which mirrors your second statement. So they're equivalent for a single dimension. And we get those two statement equally strong in Euclidean space of arbitrary dimension. Verify it. But let's not stop here.
      Consider your first statement in a non-Euclidean space. In this case, the expression for our potential is $U=A ({sqrt {g_{mu nu}dx^mu dx^nu}})^2=Ag_{mu nu}dx^mu dx^nu$. According to your second statement, we expect $F^mu=-Bdx^mu$.

      According to the definition of force, $$F^mu=-g^{mu nu}nabla_nu U=-g^{mu nu}partial_nu(Ag_{sigma rho}dx^sigma dx^rho)=-2Adx^mu-Ag^{mu nu}g_{sigma rho, nu}dx^rho dx^sigma.$$So, if we want this last expression to meet our expectation, we must impose one condition, that is the value of $g_{sigma rho,nu}$ must be zero.



      So, it seems that for the later case your second statement impose more restriction than your first one. So your first statement is more general, but the second one is stronger.

      Plea: Can someone please verify my claims and calculation for the non-Euclidean part?






      share|cite|improve this answer










      New contributor



      Minotaur is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.





      $endgroup$



      Let's consider your first statement. If the potential energy of a particle under oscillatory motion is directly proportional to the second power of displacement from the mean position, then we can write the expression for potential at any position $x$ as $$U(x-x_0)=A(x-x_0)^2$$ where $A$ is our proportionality constant and $x_0$ is the mean position, which makes $x-x_0$ the displacement from the mean position. After expanding $$U(x-x_0)=Ax_0^2-2Ax_0x+Ax^2.$$ Now we know that $F=-{dU(x-x_0) over dx}$. So, for our potential energy, it becomes- $$F=-(-2Ax_0+2Ax)=2Ax_0-2Ax=-2A(x-x_0)$$ which mirrors your second statement. So they're equivalent for a single dimension. And we get those two statement equally strong in Euclidean space of arbitrary dimension. Verify it. But let's not stop here.
      Consider your first statement in a non-Euclidean space. In this case, the expression for our potential is $U=A ({sqrt {g_{mu nu}dx^mu dx^nu}})^2=Ag_{mu nu}dx^mu dx^nu$. According to your second statement, we expect $F^mu=-Bdx^mu$.

      According to the definition of force, $$F^mu=-g^{mu nu}nabla_nu U=-g^{mu nu}partial_nu(Ag_{sigma rho}dx^sigma dx^rho)=-2Adx^mu-Ag^{mu nu}g_{sigma rho, nu}dx^rho dx^sigma.$$So, if we want this last expression to meet our expectation, we must impose one condition, that is the value of $g_{sigma rho,nu}$ must be zero.



      So, it seems that for the later case your second statement impose more restriction than your first one. So your first statement is more general, but the second one is stronger.

      Plea: Can someone please verify my claims and calculation for the non-Euclidean part?







      share|cite|improve this answer










      New contributor



      Minotaur is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.








      share|cite|improve this answer



      share|cite|improve this answer








      edited 6 hours ago





















      New contributor



      Minotaur is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.








      answered 10 hours ago









      MinotaurMinotaur

      616 bronze badges




      616 bronze badges




      New contributor



      Minotaur is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.




      New contributor




      Minotaur is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
      Check out our Code of Conduct.













      • 2




        $begingroup$
        The force you calculated is proportional to the negative displacement. The first statement is not weaker, at least not because of your reasoning.
        $endgroup$
        – Puk
        10 hours ago








      • 1




        $begingroup$
        Wait, why isn't $nabla_nu U=partial_nu U$ given that $U$ is a scalar and that the covariant derivative is the same as a partial derivative for a scalar?
        $endgroup$
        – Dvij Mankad
        7 hours ago








      • 1




        $begingroup$
        The issue with your calculation raised in my previous comment might be related to this but, anyway, your indices in the second term of your final expression are messed up. You have two $alpha$s upstairs and two $rho$s downstairs. Might be an independent mistake--I haven't explicitly gone through your calculation.
        $endgroup$
        – Dvij Mankad
        7 hours ago








      • 1




        $begingroup$
        @DvijMankad , I've followed your lead, recalculated and edited it. This time it needs less restriction.
        $endgroup$
        – Minotaur
        7 hours ago






      • 1




        $begingroup$
        Finally, since $dx^rho_{,nu}=delta^rho_nu$, your first term collapses to $-2Adx^mu$. And, your second term is a second-order infinitesimal while the first is a first-order one. So, you have to drop the second term leading to no difference between the non-Euclidean case and the Euclidean case. xD
        $endgroup$
        – Dvij Mankad
        6 hours ago














      • 2




        $begingroup$
        The force you calculated is proportional to the negative displacement. The first statement is not weaker, at least not because of your reasoning.
        $endgroup$
        – Puk
        10 hours ago








      • 1




        $begingroup$
        Wait, why isn't $nabla_nu U=partial_nu U$ given that $U$ is a scalar and that the covariant derivative is the same as a partial derivative for a scalar?
        $endgroup$
        – Dvij Mankad
        7 hours ago








      • 1




        $begingroup$
        The issue with your calculation raised in my previous comment might be related to this but, anyway, your indices in the second term of your final expression are messed up. You have two $alpha$s upstairs and two $rho$s downstairs. Might be an independent mistake--I haven't explicitly gone through your calculation.
        $endgroup$
        – Dvij Mankad
        7 hours ago








      • 1




        $begingroup$
        @DvijMankad , I've followed your lead, recalculated and edited it. This time it needs less restriction.
        $endgroup$
        – Minotaur
        7 hours ago






      • 1




        $begingroup$
        Finally, since $dx^rho_{,nu}=delta^rho_nu$, your first term collapses to $-2Adx^mu$. And, your second term is a second-order infinitesimal while the first is a first-order one. So, you have to drop the second term leading to no difference between the non-Euclidean case and the Euclidean case. xD
        $endgroup$
        – Dvij Mankad
        6 hours ago








      2




      2




      $begingroup$
      The force you calculated is proportional to the negative displacement. The first statement is not weaker, at least not because of your reasoning.
      $endgroup$
      – Puk
      10 hours ago






      $begingroup$
      The force you calculated is proportional to the negative displacement. The first statement is not weaker, at least not because of your reasoning.
      $endgroup$
      – Puk
      10 hours ago






      1




      1




      $begingroup$
      Wait, why isn't $nabla_nu U=partial_nu U$ given that $U$ is a scalar and that the covariant derivative is the same as a partial derivative for a scalar?
      $endgroup$
      – Dvij Mankad
      7 hours ago






      $begingroup$
      Wait, why isn't $nabla_nu U=partial_nu U$ given that $U$ is a scalar and that the covariant derivative is the same as a partial derivative for a scalar?
      $endgroup$
      – Dvij Mankad
      7 hours ago






      1




      1




      $begingroup$
      The issue with your calculation raised in my previous comment might be related to this but, anyway, your indices in the second term of your final expression are messed up. You have two $alpha$s upstairs and two $rho$s downstairs. Might be an independent mistake--I haven't explicitly gone through your calculation.
      $endgroup$
      – Dvij Mankad
      7 hours ago






      $begingroup$
      The issue with your calculation raised in my previous comment might be related to this but, anyway, your indices in the second term of your final expression are messed up. You have two $alpha$s upstairs and two $rho$s downstairs. Might be an independent mistake--I haven't explicitly gone through your calculation.
      $endgroup$
      – Dvij Mankad
      7 hours ago






      1




      1




      $begingroup$
      @DvijMankad , I've followed your lead, recalculated and edited it. This time it needs less restriction.
      $endgroup$
      – Minotaur
      7 hours ago




      $begingroup$
      @DvijMankad , I've followed your lead, recalculated and edited it. This time it needs less restriction.
      $endgroup$
      – Minotaur
      7 hours ago




      1




      1




      $begingroup$
      Finally, since $dx^rho_{,nu}=delta^rho_nu$, your first term collapses to $-2Adx^mu$. And, your second term is a second-order infinitesimal while the first is a first-order one. So, you have to drop the second term leading to no difference between the non-Euclidean case and the Euclidean case. xD
      $endgroup$
      – Dvij Mankad
      6 hours ago




      $begingroup$
      Finally, since $dx^rho_{,nu}=delta^rho_nu$, your first term collapses to $-2Adx^mu$. And, your second term is a second-order infinitesimal while the first is a first-order one. So, you have to drop the second term leading to no difference between the non-Euclidean case and the Euclidean case. xD
      $endgroup$
      – Dvij Mankad
      6 hours ago













      3













      $begingroup$

      Both of your statements are true for SHM and can be seen as true for approximations as well. Each statement is essentially saying the same thing, because $F=-text dU/text dx$, and we can choose $U(0)=0$. Whether or not you use approximations to make these statements applicable to your system doesn't change that.



      In other words, if you have approximated $Upropto x^2$, then you are also approximating $Fpropto -x$. Both of your statements say the same thing. Therefore, they are equally "strong".






      share|cite|improve this answer









      $endgroup$




















        3













        $begingroup$

        Both of your statements are true for SHM and can be seen as true for approximations as well. Each statement is essentially saying the same thing, because $F=-text dU/text dx$, and we can choose $U(0)=0$. Whether or not you use approximations to make these statements applicable to your system doesn't change that.



        In other words, if you have approximated $Upropto x^2$, then you are also approximating $Fpropto -x$. Both of your statements say the same thing. Therefore, they are equally "strong".






        share|cite|improve this answer









        $endgroup$


















          3














          3










          3







          $begingroup$

          Both of your statements are true for SHM and can be seen as true for approximations as well. Each statement is essentially saying the same thing, because $F=-text dU/text dx$, and we can choose $U(0)=0$. Whether or not you use approximations to make these statements applicable to your system doesn't change that.



          In other words, if you have approximated $Upropto x^2$, then you are also approximating $Fpropto -x$. Both of your statements say the same thing. Therefore, they are equally "strong".






          share|cite|improve this answer









          $endgroup$



          Both of your statements are true for SHM and can be seen as true for approximations as well. Each statement is essentially saying the same thing, because $F=-text dU/text dx$, and we can choose $U(0)=0$. Whether or not you use approximations to make these statements applicable to your system doesn't change that.



          In other words, if you have approximated $Upropto x^2$, then you are also approximating $Fpropto -x$. Both of your statements say the same thing. Therefore, they are equally "strong".







          share|cite|improve this answer












          share|cite|improve this answer



          share|cite|improve this answer










          answered 10 hours ago









          Aaron StevensAaron Stevens

          22.1k4 gold badges41 silver badges78 bronze badges




          22.1k4 gold badges41 silver badges78 bronze badges


























              1













              $begingroup$

              If the potential energy is quadratic in the displacement only for small oscillations, then the restoring force is proportional to the (negative) displacement only for small oscillations. So I would not say the second statement is more general. The one statement is exactly true, so is the other. If one is only approximately true, so is the other.



              Here I'm ignoring the fact that the potential energy is unique up to an arbitrary additive constant, and because of a non-zero constant it may not be proportional the the square of the displacement as in your first statement.






              share|cite|improve this answer









              $endgroup$




















                1













                $begingroup$

                If the potential energy is quadratic in the displacement only for small oscillations, then the restoring force is proportional to the (negative) displacement only for small oscillations. So I would not say the second statement is more general. The one statement is exactly true, so is the other. If one is only approximately true, so is the other.



                Here I'm ignoring the fact that the potential energy is unique up to an arbitrary additive constant, and because of a non-zero constant it may not be proportional the the square of the displacement as in your first statement.






                share|cite|improve this answer









                $endgroup$


















                  1














                  1










                  1







                  $begingroup$

                  If the potential energy is quadratic in the displacement only for small oscillations, then the restoring force is proportional to the (negative) displacement only for small oscillations. So I would not say the second statement is more general. The one statement is exactly true, so is the other. If one is only approximately true, so is the other.



                  Here I'm ignoring the fact that the potential energy is unique up to an arbitrary additive constant, and because of a non-zero constant it may not be proportional the the square of the displacement as in your first statement.






                  share|cite|improve this answer









                  $endgroup$



                  If the potential energy is quadratic in the displacement only for small oscillations, then the restoring force is proportional to the (negative) displacement only for small oscillations. So I would not say the second statement is more general. The one statement is exactly true, so is the other. If one is only approximately true, so is the other.



                  Here I'm ignoring the fact that the potential energy is unique up to an arbitrary additive constant, and because of a non-zero constant it may not be proportional the the square of the displacement as in your first statement.







                  share|cite|improve this answer












                  share|cite|improve this answer



                  share|cite|improve this answer










                  answered 10 hours ago









                  PukPuk

                  1,6063 silver badges11 bronze badges




                  1,6063 silver badges11 bronze badges

































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