Mdthbs

Had an issue today with a nail going through a water supply line in a bathroom. It got me wondering if there is a practical or technical reason there aren’t typically room-specific shut offs between the master shut off and the shut offs at the fixtures? Seems silly to shut down the whole house for a pinhole, but there really wasn’t a better option.

Just asking out of curiosity to see if there are any plumbers out there.

The Viega Manabloc is an example of a system in which a central valve manifold uses a dedicated tube for every fixture in the house, as alluded in the comment from BillDOe.

In some US homes it's not a difficult retrofit to split the house into at least two zones. Typically the water service enters an unfinished "utility closet" space where the water heater is also located. There will be a few tees and water pipes head off in different directions to the master bathroom, kitchen, other bathrooms, etc. These pipes could be cut and valves inserted so that water can be shut off somewhat selectively.

In my own house I reconfigured the plumbing in the utility room. I have the kitchen and basement bathroom on one pair of valves (one each for hot and cold) and the laundry and other bathrooms on a different pair. These are arranged neatly beside the water heater. This has allowed me to defer replacing the shutoff under every sink and toilet, which always seem to be jammed and/or corroded to the point that they can't be shut off when it's needed most.

It's not as fine-grained as the manifold approach, but routine plumbing repairs are far less stressful when at least one toilet in the house remains functional!

Now, to actually answer your question. It cost less than US$100 in parts and several hours of work to make that change in my house. Doing the work that way during original construction would cost almost as much. It doesn't happen because the home buyer doesn't want to pay extra for it, the builder doesn't want to pay for it from his own pocket, and the plumber isn't going to do this premium/extra work for free.

This is a result of building as efficiently (cheaply) as possible, and there is almost no need for room valves.

First, efficiency:

• Valves are more expensive than pipe. Extra valves means more labor cost.


• If the valves are to be centrally located, then more pipe is required because each "zone" will have to be home-run instead of branching off a shared pipe. Extra pipe means more labor cost.


• If the valves are not centrally located, then they need to be located somewhere accessible to be utilized. That means either designing a space for them, or locating them somewhere not in the way. Extra design work and extra pipe means more labor cost.

Second, there is little need to install valves in advance:

• In an emergency, shutting off the water to the house for a couple of hours (or a day) while waiting for a plumber (or a run to the hardware store) is an inconvenience that most people can manage.


• Each fixture usually has its own shutoff.


• The most common leaks are at fixtures, not in pipes.


• If you need a valve to facilitate a renovation while the house is occupied, it's easy to plan to shut off the water to the house briefly to install a local valve.

In summary, the expense of the extra valves, pipe and labor are not worth it, especially from the perspective of a builder, where a small reduction in cost per home built results in a large savings overall.

It would be difficult to install area shutoffs in most residences, since they need to be accessible to be useful. The best case scenario is an access panel in the floor or wall, the worst case is outside the room in an adjoining room or closet.

Even more damning is the fact that they would, by definition, be in non-standard locations. I pity the poor plumber who's faced with a closed shutoff someplace between the main and fixture shutoff. If it's a newly purchased home, or the knowledgeable person isn't home during the service call you'd never find it.

Here in the UK you commonly find a stopcock in the kitchen for the cold supply to everything except the sink, in the cupboard under the sink (Sometimes the hot as well, but most appliances are cold fill only these days).

I imagine this is because if an appliance like a washing machine or dishwasher is leaking slightly, it's not immediately obvious which appliance. Also getting at its service valve usually means pulling the appliance out from under the work-top and then crawling behind it, which may be beyond the strength or agility of some householders. It gives you the option to easily turn off the appliances without ending up with an uninhabitable house with no water at all.

It was a god-send when my downstairs neighbour told me he had water tricking through his ceiling. It wasn't a faulty appliance. Turned out a rodent had got under the floor and had chewed through the water pipe to the appliances. Had to dismantle half the kitchen to fix it, but fortunately I still had a kitchen sink and bathroom while that was sorted out. BTW always check whether your insurer excludes rodents chewing through pipes or wires before it happens -- it's expensive if they do.

Tradition is not to do it ; It is difficult to get contractors or plumbers to change. When I drew up my house plans I put a valve at each water use point ( You don't need each room). Although I was there most of the construction I missed that the plumbers did not put in shut off valves for either tub/ shower . I need them now , it is very inconvenient to shut off the whole house. My required shut off at inlet AND outlet of hot water heaters has been useful. Likewise , the framers want 24" doors on bathrooms ; I supervised one and got the 36" door shown on the drawing. I missed the second one and had to take out the framers 24" and put in a 28" rough opening after the framers left.

The guy who wrote this probably works for Viega and they are trying to advertise the Viega manabloc, silly. The other guy who responded gave to much info on trying to sell the product (what a surprise Viega employee). There is no better than tree and branch method. The manabloc only works on very small homes where it might be convenient. Just imagine having stagnant water on unused lines that just scares me and plus it is very difficult to recirculate hot water on a manabloc (most runs on manabloc are a minimum not 5' or greater. It is always recommended to run the main line feeding the house on the hot side as close as possible to the fixtures to have minimum water loss and if possible go back in the water heater to have it reheated and in the cold water side if you can have the least used fixtures feed water first and at last the most used so Everytime you flush or open a fixture it brings new water in.

As for the guy asking the question... Every time you branch off a main line you would have to put a valve Wich would be very inconvenient plus where would you leave access? I bet you won't even install valves at every room even if you have your house custom build, it is just not convenient. Most codes make you put 6" metal nail plates on bottom and top places incase you put baseboards you won't hit a pex, PVC or gas line and in-between studs too.so what you need to do is educate your self if you are drilling sheet rock drill and once you feel you are about to be pass the sheet rock, STOP. Then get something not sharp same size as hole and stick in the hole 😂 no lube no nothing lol and feel if there are any pipes, ducts or cables, also don't get a fookin screw too big.